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CDP Legal?

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taxman	CDP Legal?	Lead	[-]
Posts: 15 Feb 7 12 3:03 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None STI widebody Tactical 5" with a bushing barrel in 45 acp? The reason for my question is it has a longer dust cover with a built in light rail.

RickL		#1	[-]
Posts: 738 Feb 7 12 3:45 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Longer or Full Length? There is a rule discussion somewhere about the distance from the slide stop center to the end of the dustcover although this has not been cast into the rulebook yet. If it is not full legnth, the standard STI 2011 frame is good. Run one myself on occasion. Rick A27521
taxman		#2	[-]
Posts: 15 Feb 7 12 3:48 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The Tactical frame dust cover is about half way in length between the standard frame and a full length dust cover.
Tarkeg		#3	[-]
Posts: 582 Feb 7 12 3:48 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	It's awfully close to full length. And I can't find any info about a bushing model. They all list bushingless. Is yours a one off? Toran A27623
waktasz		#4	[-]
Posts: 1107 Feb 7 12 4:39 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Specifications MSRP $2,018.99 Calibers 9×19, .40S&W, .45ACP Frame STI Patented Modular Steel, Long, with Tactical Rail Grips STI Patented Glass Filled Polymer Modular (Black) Slide 5.0″ Classic 4140 Carbon Steel Slide Slide Features Unique with Front & Rear Cocking Serrations, Flat Top Trigger STI Long Curve Barrel 5.01” STI Bull Barrel, Ramped, Fully Supported Hammer STI Square style Safeties STI Blue High Rise Beavertail Grip Safety and Ambi Thumb Safeties Guide Rod STI Recoil Master Sights STI Ramped Front, Novak style Fixed Rear Overall Length 8.5” Weight 37.5 oz Finish Blued (Matte) Competition Approval USPSA IPSC If yours in fact does have a bushing I'd say it's legal. The rulebook says no full length dustcovers, not no extended dustcovers. www.youtube.com/waktasz www.Super-Tactical.com ~Matt O Former IDPA member, 2004-2013
taxman		#5	[-]
Posts: 15 Feb 7 12 5:29 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I believe you can order any STI with either a bull or bushing barrel.
waktasz		#6	[-]
Posts: 1107 Feb 7 12 8:37 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	hmm, I didn't know that. I thought they would specify it for a model that was available both ways, like on the Eagle's spec page. www.youtube.com/waktasz www.Super-Tactical.com ~Matt O Former IDPA member, 2004-2013
freeidaho		#7	[-]
Posts: 6356 Feb 7 12 10:44 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Howdy, Wish the dust cover thing was cleared up, because we have seen that "not quite full length" does not pass muster some places. I suspect the Tiger Team will tackle it. I propose the distance between the muzzle end of the slide and the dust cover must be greater than or equal to the barrel length X 0.20. Under this proposal a 5" gun must have 1" or more distance between the muzzle end of the slide and the dust cover. The multiplier may need to be tweaked to satisfy the founders, but it is a measurement and formula that could apply to any gun. Ken Reed Last Edited By: freeidaho Feb 7 12 11:00 PM. Edited 1 times.
Tarkeg		#8	[-]
Posts: 582 Feb 7 12 11:31 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I would like to see the "no full length dust covers" requirement just go away. With modern designs that more and more utilize light rails, they're very common. As long as they make weight and fit in the box, why not? Toran A27623
wnymatt		#9	[-]
Posts: 614 Feb 8 12 2:59 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	+1, the rule made sense in 1996 when full length dust covers were added to 1911's for weight. Now everyone seems to think their guns need a rail and it keeps getting harder to buy a gun without one. The last thing I want to see is a rule that makes popular carry models illegal even if they fit the box and make weight. How many rules do you need about the weight of the gun when you already have a max weight for the gun? Matt
calebg		#10	[-]
Posts: 232 Feb 8 12 6:21 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tarkeg wrote: As long as they make weight and fit in the box, why not? I'd like to see that applied to a lot of things though w/regards to the rules. Come on, Carry Optics division! Caleb A34015

robertbank.czechpistols82792		#11	[-]
Posts: 1780 Feb 9 12 11:21 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	wnymatt wrote: +1, the rule made sense in 1996 when full length dust covers were added to 1911's for weight. Now everyone seems to think their guns need a rail and it keeps getting harder to buy a gun without one. The last thing I want to see is a rule that makes popular carry models illegal even if they fit the box and make weight. How many rules do you need about the weight of the gun when you already have a max weight for the gun? Bang on. The CZ97B weighs two oz. less than max yet can't play because of the FLDC. If you can carry a 53oz revolver or a 43oz ESP gun then why not a 43 oz SSP gun? We might be better off just using USPSA/IPSC Production gun list. Simple to copy and it works. Starting DA/SA guns hammer back, the same way they would be carried is also something that should be addressed. At least that way we might see more DA/SA guns in SSP. Right now they are not competitive in SSP. There were only 4 CZ's at the World Championships and a handful of Tanfoglios. Take Care Bob The best shooters in IDPA don't have to cheat to win and the rest of us can't cheat enough to win, so why bother If you need to cheat you don't have enough talent to win! www.idpacanada.ca Facta Non Verba
Tarkeg		#12	[-]
Posts: 582 Feb 9 12 12:59 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	calebg wrote: Tarkeg wrote: As long as they make weight and fit in the box, why not? I'd like to see that applied to a lot of things though w/regards to the rules. Come on, Carry Optics division! That's a whole different ball of wax.... Toran A27623
taxman		#13	[-]
Posts: 15 Feb 29 12 1:57 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Since apparently there are several AC as well as Robert Ray monitoring this 'official' forum, I ask again, "is it legal"? Lee
Bubba		#14	[-]
Posts: 2274 Feb 29 12 10:37 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Post a picture and you'll get a better answer. The description is too nebulous to make a call. Terry "Bubba" Burba http://www.dbl-tap.com "Do I shoot more than write?" uhhhhh..... IDPA - SOI, Texas Tactical - CSO, TDSA - Asst. Instructor, Copperas Cove Pistol Club, Temple Gun Club
Shootaglock		#15	[-]
Posts: 2388 Mar 1 12 10:47 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Bubba wrote: Post a picture and you'll get a better answer. The description is too nebulous to make a call. Something like this I would say is legal at our matches. http://www.gunsamerica.co...119984/wm_md_2062485.jpg (But I am a "words mean something" guy and the rule says no full length dust cover, not no extended dust cover. Any intent in the rule should have been written in, otherwise it is not communicated and for practical purposes does not exist. ) This would not be legal. http://www.tactical1911.n...ds/STI-Tactical-1911.png Given that it is a steel frame. But I am only speaking as one MD, so this is really no help at the end of the day. (I tried to paste in the actual pictures. They were there while writing, but would not post.) Jimmy A21485 Last Edited By: Shootaglock Mar 1 12 10:52 AM. Edited 2 times.
Steve Koski		#16	[-]
Posts: 5929 Mar 2 12 4:11 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Linky no workey.
Shootaglock		#17	[-]
Posts: 2388 Mar 2 12 8:54 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Me no speaky computer, so no help from me. Works for me. If you google or bing the model you get images of both the full dust cover model and the model with the rail that is longer than a standard dust cover. Jimmy A21485
wnymatt		#18	[-]
Posts: 614 Mar 2 12 9:38 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	If this works, this is a pic of a tactical with the longer but not full length dust cover/rail http://freedom.ispeeds.net/~STOKEY/sti1.jpg I can't imagine and SO/MD arguing that that is "full length" under current rules. Matt
wnymatt		#19	[-]
Posts: 614 Mar 2 12 9:41 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	This one is full length. http://www.tactical-life..../01/tactical415_main.png Matt
Bubba		#20	[-]
Posts: 2274 Mar 2 12 10:29 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	And the last two pictures indicate WHY there hasn't been a ruling in this thread. Same name on the gun. Two different dust covers. The second one is definitely NOT legal. The one above it may or may not be depending on how far that light rail extends. I know there were some rulings issued in the past about light rail length. But there hasn't been any hard and fast definition. Yes, it IS on the list of things to clarify for the equipment team. For STI guns, they are pretty clear on their web site which of their guns are IDPA approved. I would go by their listings for now. Terry "Bubba" Burba http://www.dbl-tap.com "Do I shoot more than write?" uhhhhh..... IDPA - SOI, Texas Tactical - CSO, TDSA - Asst. Instructor, Copperas Cove Pistol Club, Temple Gun Club

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