Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Gregg Kratochvil) — Tue, 25 Nov 2008 14:24:21 GMT

FieldShunt wrote:

This is rough for sixgunners who reload with the weak hand while maintaining the grip on the gun with the shooting hand.

Fortunately, most course designers seem to make the break point at six for simplicity's sake.

Bill

A good reason to practice switch hand reloading just for such an occasion.

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (FieldShunt) — Tue, 25 Nov 2008 13:36:29 GMT

This is rough for sixgunners who reload with the weak hand while maintaining the grip on the gun with the shooting hand.

Fortunately, most course designers seem to make the break point at six for simplicity's sake.

Bill

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (SauconValleyShooter) — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 22:59:14 GMT

Good Evening,

Frank, when I was keeping everything (empties and loaded cartridges) I would cup my hand to my chest and make a pocket to catch everything coming from the cylinder. It worked pretty well.

Ken

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (frank) — Tue, 23 Sep 2008 20:08:33 GMT

During the Alabama State match the COF design made it necessary for me to RWR before engaging some droppers. I had three loaded and three empties in my 686. I dumped the whole cylinder load into my hand, transferred to my vest pocket and reloaded and proceeded on to finish the stage.
I was pretty proud of myself until the SO walked me back to my reloading point and there was one of my live rounds on the ground.

I know it was mine but I have no idea how it got there. I either...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (COF) — Fri, 19 Sep 2008 11:40:55 GMT

If you want to keep a loaded Curt around, that's your problem. That's a whole lot worse than a loaded gun - you can put the loaded gun in a holster, in a closet, wherever you want and it won't make any noise until you pull the trigger. A loaded Curt goes off all the time... and I'm not even going to got there about pulling his trigger

Jerry

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Blair Wakeham) — Fri, 19 Sep 2008 10:51:48 GMT

"...another question Jerry :

Curt is round. If he gets loaded, do I have to keep him?

See you in a few weeks,

Craig"

Craig,

I believe you can dump him on the ground so long as you don't leave that location. If you want to leave you have to stow him safely prior to departure, then you may again dump him at the end of the night.

B

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (SauconValleyShooter) — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:53:58 GMT

Good Morning,

I used to drop the whole mess into my pocket for the tac reload, but because of this thread, I tried something different at the last match we had at Phillispburg. I had two occasions to tac reload, one was a no light stage. I opened the cylinder, and let whatever wanted to come out, drop. Each time the two unfired rounds and one empty case fell into my hand. As I ejected the remaining empties, I dropped the two rounds and one empty into my pocket and then went on with...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Bones) — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:03:29 GMT

...another question Jerry :

Curt is round. If he gets loaded, do I have to keep him?

See you in a few weeks,

Craig

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (COF) — Sat, 13 Sep 2008 07:33:01 GMT

Plain and simple, empties do not have to be retained, loaded rounds do.

Jerry Mosher
On 2nd decade of IDPA
On 4th decade of Wheelgunning

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (stretch64) — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 22:10:18 GMT

Right, I think we're on the same page. The question was what about the empties when the gun is not empty. We all seem to agree they do not need to be retained. The phrasing I highlighted in your response is what I've been told by SOs that want me to retain the empties.

Robert

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (robertbank) — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 21:53:32 GMT

Thought that is what I said. If your revolver is empty dump them on the ground. If it is not you must retain the unfired rds.

No offense taken.

If there are rounds remaining in the cylinder and the shooter chooses to do a reload the unexpended rounds would have to be retained. By making the stage revolver neutral the designer would not have the revolver shooter having to do a reload with retention (ie rds in gun but not enough to complete the next part of the stage...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (stretch64) — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 21:40:06 GMT

robertbank wrote:
I would take that to mean unless you have a round left in the cylinder you can dump your empties on the ground.

This is the opinion I disagree with. (No offense, Bob). The argument for it has been Revolver Neutral states "You cannot ask a person with an empty gun to retain unexpended rounds". If...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (robertbank) — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 20:08:50 GMT

With a revolver IF all six cartridges are now empty, as is the gun, there would be no reason or provision to retain the empties as this would be inconsistent with a pistol's emergency reload.

That said read the Note on page 42 of the rule book. "HQ urges course designers to draft scenario courses that do not require tac-loads ore reloads with retention to be performed 'on the clock'".

What is interesting is that in all three descriptions of the...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Radome) — Mon, 08 Sep 2008 12:01:02 GMT

The wheel gunners are a dis-advantaged bunch aren't they?

I say that as a joke because we have a master who out shoots everyone with a revlover.

As an SO, unless someone told me otherwise (I am standing by) , I'd be happy just to see the shooter not dump the speed loader on the ground and replace it in a pocket.
Empties do not belong in pockets. This is a well documented issue from the early days of combat handguns and is addressed in 'Revolver Neutral'.

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Taildraggerdave) — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:36:26 GMT

I imagine it's because my computer is messed up. Am able to copy and paste everything else....
Thanks for doing it though.

Take care,
Dave

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Gregg Kratochvil) — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 20:38:28 GMT

Dave
Here is the copy and paste from the rule book glossary page 80, not sure way you are unable to copy and paste.

Revolver Neutral: A descriptive term for a CoF which does not call for revolver shooters to do impossible things. This does NOT mean that every CoF should require six (6) rounds or less. This does mean that, if a CoF requires a tactical reload, the tactical reload...

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Taildraggerdave) — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 19:11:46 GMT

I can't copy and paste out of an Adobe pdf but if you look at the Glossary in the IDPA rulebook under "Revolver Neutral" it talks about not having to retain empty cases. I went through the entire rulebook looking for that info because I knew it was there. Finally found it in the very back.

Take care,
Dave

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Rick) — Mon, 01 Sep 2008 11:41:02 GMT

I performed two RWR in yesterday's match. The first to avoid reloading in inconvenient places and the other because the stage required movement after engaging a disappearing target and it was gone with one round left and a lot of ground to cover so I RWR and moved on. Incidently I let one empty slip through my fingers, I left it behind. No penalty.

Rick

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (Jim Watson) — Mon, 01 Sep 2008 08:57:55 GMT

I let gravity drop the unfired rounds into my hand before I kick the empties.

That is what I did when shooting a lot of SSR. Lets you save the loaded rounds and eject the empties. Not terribly slow and definitely constitutes Doing Right versus "dumping the whole mess in a pocket."

Re: Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (RePete) — Mon, 01 Sep 2008 08:56:51 GMT

As a revolver shooter, my take is that only the live rounds have to be kept.

That being said, I pocket the empties too, when I'm shooting SSR, for speed. But when I'm shhoting ESR, I have no choice - moonclips.

Revolver reload with retention

feeds@yuku.com (stretch64) — Fri, 29 Aug 2008 20:41:37 GMT

This question came up a few months ago at an SO certification course. When doing a TR/RWR with a revolver, is it necessary to retain the empty cases? The rulebook doesn't really cover it for revolvers that I can see.

Robert